Blown away

I hope this was just a misunderstanding on my part but when I called to book the lady told me it was 1900. per person and I said don't I get half off and she said that is half off. I said you mean the regular price is 4000.00 and she said yes. I said thank you and hung up.

Unfortunately, Sally, many of us faithful riders, who have seen our beloved boats through thick and thin, are having the same reaction as you. Last year at this time I had three trips booked for 2007 on the DELTA QUEEN. At this time I have 0 (ZERO) trips booked for 2008. I will also cherish the wonderful memories and many friends I have made on the boat, but I am a working girl and I can't justify the cost that is being offered at the present time. My only wish is for the best for our beloved boats and so I hope they are booked full and have a waiting list for cancellations. I'm doubting that is the case.

This is also a reason why I stopped, I'm very sorry to say!

Sally, trust me...from the e-mails that have been flying around for the past month, anybody that has cruised on any of the Queens is very painfully aware of "MAL's Folly". Deb and I, too, typically have our next years DQ cruises, typically 3, booked by now, not this year. I wonder if MAL is missing our deposit money up front, so to speak. I VENTED big time to Phyllis about this, and I'm honestly sorry I did that, I mean she doesn't deserve that at all, but I had to vent to somebody. Sorry, Phyllis...

I guess Deb and I will have to wait until MAL becomes desperate enough to offer an affordable rate, at least affordable to the Krause's. Now I can appreciate an increase in rate to be close to the rate of inflation, and I'll be the first to say that the DQ crew is worth more than their weight in gold, and "how do you put a price on the DQ experience", but an increase of 100% plus?

We are putting our hat on the premis of last minute deals, for now. That's how Deb and I managed our May Black Warrior cruise, and absolutely wonderful it was. Even the huge cost in last minute plane tickets were ok when hooked up with the great DQ room rate we got. Maybe that is the new "secret", you book a cruise within 8 weeks of departure, taking advantage of the last minute 7 nights for a bunk deals? Right now, DQ bunk rooms are about $1250 per night, rack rate. Can you imagine what the rack rate is on 119 or 308? I will tell you that we could buy a new car, a small one, but a new one none the less, for 7 nights in an "A", rack rate...

I agree with you, I don't understand the logic here at all. To list Two-fer rates that are higher than last year's rack rates...pluhease! Quite a few of us that keep in touch actually thought that the rates posted on MAL's website were rack rates and we just didn't understand the supposed two for one deals...not so.

Now if none of this comes to pass...then we may say it was a great "ride" while it lasted and will look into the cruises Frank Prudent describes about the QE2, and elsewhere...I will say that these MAL rates make even, bite my tongue, the River Explorer look somewhat attractive...sacriledge, I know...

God, I hope that doesn't have to be what happens...

For most of my teaching career I worked with slow learners. Remember last year when MAL announced their first year's rates and said there would be absolutely positively NO specials... and now we are inundated with the 'specials' because their egotistical rates didn't sell? So what did they learn? Absolutely NOTHING! They are having to do these specials this year because they aren't filling up two boats. Remember, the souped up, renovated MQ with her 300 berths will also be back next March 8 (wink, wink)! Of course, we are all committing the cardinal sin now of saying something negative about MAL, which Franz has asked us not to do, but sorry Franz, at some point the facts have to be stated. While I was priced out way back in 1984, I was lucky to have made 39 trips by that time.(I've taken just 2 more in the interim.) These enthusiastic passengers who have just posted haven't had that good fortune yet, and probably won't as long as MAJESTIC keeps their Stephen Colbertish snobbery regarding prices and their inflated view of their own value. Franz, you said to give MAL a chance... People have heeded your request to not post negatively, but that hasn't stopped the email and word of mouth transmission of problems/downgrades this year.. I'd suggest that those of you who have been spending your money these recent years, and who now think you won't be putting out these sums to ride, that you contact Giersdorf directly with this info... we know somebody checks the board, but just as congressmen need to be contacted directly about the DQ exemption, so MAL should be contacted directly about their DQ/AQ/MQ executions...

The difference between fair criticism and company bashing

Maybe by request for not posting negatively about MAL was misleading ... It was about not giving the press and political representatives the (wrong and misleading) picture of a company who doesn't know how to manage boats anyway so it may make no difference whether there will be an exemption for the DQ or not. This request still stands.

What we can do (and where I don't have any objections doing so on the message board) is expressing our disappointment about the high rates, for example. Everthing that does have to do with ourselves, our personal situation, the perspective of a steamboat buff, our observations when cruising the boats, etc.

But we simply are not in the position to question the company's strategy and we shouldn't pretend to be experts in judging whether MAL is or will be successful. It's not up to us to insult the MAL management by blaming them for having no idea what they're doing. If you want do to so, buy stocks from Ambassadors International and speak up at their stock holder meetings. That's the right place to question the competency of a company's management. (Just to mention it, but don't want to make this a point in my argumentation at all: MAL as part of Ambassadors International is a public company. One may easily be taken responsible for stock value losses caused by publishing misleading or wrong facts about a company. When posting, also take in account what damage you may cause and whether you can proof (juridically) what you're saying.)

What do we know?
What I mean with this is: Has anyone of you ever been a senior manager in the cruise industry? Has anyone of you years of experience in managing a big cruise company? I'm sure most of you don't have experience in managing a multi-million-dollar company at all. Does anyone of you have detailed numbers, market analysis about the cruise market? Does anyone of you know the numbers of DQSC from the past years, the numbers of Delaware north, the numbers of MAL this year? NO, WE DON'T! The only thing we (and I say "we" because I include myself in all that) have is assumtions. We only see symptoms. We only see a small fraction of what makes it to run a company like MAL. We don't know anything about the strategies, we don't know anything about the internal plans, the difficulties, the targets Ambassadors International has requested from Mr. Giersdorf.

Some examples from a totally different industry
Being in the management team of a publishing company, being responsible for a couple of monthly magazines, let me give you some examples why not everything that seams to be obvious necessarily is really true: We do special issues from these magazines, usually one-shots about a specific topic. These special issues are priced at an incredibly high level: 100 pages on cheap paper with an average content quality for around $20 (!). Why not pricing them at $6.50 and sell three times as much copies? If you know the numbers behind the assumed obvious fact that selling more copies is better, it's very clear why: To sell magazines on the newsstand, you have to print much more copies than you can sell - like 3 or 4 times as much. That's a fact and true for all print publications. When calculating the business plan for such a magazine you'll find out that printing 30.000 copies and selling 5.000 of them at a rate of $20 makes much more money than selling 12.000 copies at $6.50. You're at break-even much earlier, which means the risk is much smaller. And experience shows that it's easier and more reliable to sell these high-priced 5.000 copies than finding two or three times as much customers willing to buy this magaine at all no mater of it's price.

An other example: Our flag-ship magazine sells around 150.000 copies per month, some of our competitors sell more than 350.000 copies. Assumed obvious fact: Our competitors are doing much better business than we do. Wrong! It would take too much space here to explain the details, but because of a sophisticated strategy and a solid ad sales story we in fact make much more money than the competitors do. Hard to understand from outside, but a proven fact.

Make MAL listen by being fair and reasonable
What do I tell you this stuff? Business in these days is much more complicated than it has been 20 or 30 years ago. It's about sophisticated strategies, about hiding your real strategy from competitors, confusing your opponents, about finding your specific niche to survive. MAL has experienced managers, they've just bought the business and are working on the right strategy for the boats. It's not only unfair to MAL but also counterproductive for what you want to reach with your comments: MAL management will not take any of us serious when our arguments are based on ignorance concerning modern business execution. Let's face it: MAL is not Greene Line Steamers. Mr. Giersdorf is not Ma Greene. MAL is a big cruise ship company, doing business in a fast growing, though very competitive and difficult market. Mr. Giersdorf is a business manager in a multi-million-dollar company in the 21. century. This is how the world is today and it doesn't make sense to question this.

Okay, finally two examples on how I think we can deal with this issue here on the message board in a fair and open way:

"How stupid ca a company be, doing xyz while it has shown in the last couple of months that ..." is not a posting I will accept, for the above reasons. While something like "I'm very dissapointed about the new rates. They make it impossible for me to ride next year and I don't think they will find enough passengers willing to to either." is totally okay as it's based on your personal experience and doesn't raise the claim of you being the better MAL senior manager. I hope this makes my point clear and I hope you understand.

Now as this is written, grill me ... I'm happy to discuss this statement with all of you, whether on the message board or in private e-mails.

Franz

Several years ago, our family got our mother on the DQ seven times during the year, including the long Pittsburgh (read New Martinsville) to Memphis concluding trip of that year. This year, we had Mom on the homecoming trip the first of May, and will take her on the Columbia River this summer (QUEEN OF THE WEST) and then on Phyllis' AQ reunion trip in December. Only if there is a stunning price reduction on something on the DQ this fall will I get her back on it. Next year, we have nothing booked, with no present plans to book anything.

Tonight, we discussed with Mom over dinner the fact that the homecoming trip next year is now 14 days long instead of 7, out of NOLA instead of Memphis, and that the starting rate is $4,000 a person for bunk beds, which neither she nor I can safely use anymore. I thought perhaps the allure of a "race" with the NATCHEZ (gee, wonder who would win that one?!?), then one with the AQ, and then finally one with our beloved BELLE might win her over. Instead, I found her rather put out that our favorite trip, seemingly everyone's favorite trip, had been messed with and had, in her eyes, been put out of reach for many of our friends, loyal river rats/return passengers who fill the boat on that trip year after year. She took it rather personally and found it to be a bit of an affront to and a dismissal of the DQ's loyal passenger base, especially on that particular trip, consistently the one each year that fills the boat with repeaters. We know that there are devoted river people who make personal sacrifices just to be on that one particular trip each year. Mom was especially not happy for their sakes and really not in a mood to consider booking.

I suppose the rationale within the company is that if we all love that trip and the race so much, more of "the same" is better yet. Perhaps a little bit of desire (greed?) to translate that into more income is understandable. I think it may be the case that they either don't know who buys the tickets on that trip (don't know the base), or else (perhaps more likely) don't care and hope to expand to a more affluent base. I wish 'em luck. God knows my momma loves that boat better than life itself, but it doesn't look like she's going to be on that trip this time. It's like losing a member of the family. Well, nuts, that boat IS a member of our family. I guess we just have to content ourselves with thinking of her as a family member who has moved away. I guess she'll still be running out there somewhere, with luck.

Lil,
We all feel exactly the same - it's heartbreaking, but none of us are going to book the BELLE Race trip next year. I could possibly bite the bullet and book Memphis to Cincinnati at that price, but I dislike being forced to pay double that amount and have to go where MAL is telling me to go - I don't want to be on the boat for 14 days, much as I love it. We are all capable and experienced enough to put our own trips together thank you.

What MAL doesn't know is that trip is affectionately known as the "Homecoming" trip, since it is the DQ's first trip of the year back to it's former Home Port of Cincinnati - many local people are on that one, as they can do it without the added cost of airfare. The only way they'll get us back is to allow us to purchase the 2nd week from Memphis to Cincinnati at half of what they're now charging. We have inquired about that already, and yes, we can get on or off any time we want, but the price remains the same. Not acceptable, and a big mistake to mess with what has become a tradition over the years for many of us.

We always eagerly await for the coming year's schedule to come out, so we can book our trips - the 2008 schedule is a big disappointment, in that the boats are each scheduled to run in their own little segment of the river system. Remember when American Classic put out a schedule like this for 2002 - don't know if this would have worked or not, as they went bankrupt shortly after that. We would like to be able to make some choices on our own - like if I want to do the Upper Miss on the DQ, I don't want to be forced to do it on the AQ, because the DQ is not going there. They can't expect to get the prices they are now asking and not let us have some choices about which boat we ride where. That's very important, as we all have our favorite boat, no matter which one it is.

Then we got slapped by the prices - talk about SHOCK! Everyone thought these were the 2-fer prices BEFORE the discount, and they weren't so bad. Then reality set in. MAL evidently thinks that by throwing in a few things like TV's, bathrobes, shaving mirrors we will be eager and willing to pay several hundred $$$$ more per day for a trip - this is not going to happen, I can assure them. I guess we could just cut the number of trips we take in half, but I find I just can't justify paying those high prices -we did not get to be their "affluent" repeat passengers by being stupid and throwing our money away!

Tell Miss Helen that I said "hi" and I look forward to seeing you all on the AQ in December!

Judy and Bruno- agree and want to add

The thing that does not make sense to me is that the crusie ship industry (like the airline industry) tends to give the biggest dscounts to the longest ticket holders. That means the earlier in advance you book and pay for a trip, the cheaper the price because the company is using your money in advance.

However, when doing that, one should buy trip insurance unless one likes to gamble. But the airline industry is also a terrible model to use because every seat on the plane seems to be priced differently. Imagine if every individual room is also priced differently. I am not just talking about about bunk beds versus queen size or with a view or without- but pricing is affected by frequent flyer miles or whether the trip was booked through a company or on the internet or a call center in India.

I would hate to see that nightmare get applied to the boats. But I should not really say much on all this since the only way I could afford the boats to begin with was by being a crew member. And that was the best job of my life with the worst pay of my life if I broke it down by hourly rate.

I do agree Bruno- you have to tell the right people at MAL and in the right way. They want to fill the boats. That is the name of the game. Any ideas from anyone on how to fill the boats would be welcomed. But filling the boats at less than cost won't help them. Maybe, we have to ask at what point or how discounts apply even if what I just said about pricing nightmares is true.

Just a thought. . .

...it doesn't make sense to question this...

"Mr. Giersdorf is a business manager in a multi-million-dollar company in the 21. century. This is how the world is today and it doesn't make sense to question this." -Franz - And why doesn't it make sense to question this? Why shouldn't the people who have been pouring their money into the company vial trip fares, not stocks, be able to question things? When Bruno posted after his last trip, he very happily reported the return of several things which MAL had previously deleted. Why had they been returned, because everybody was a good little boy or girl and kept their opinions to themselves? No, because they expressed their concerns both here on the board and in their comment cards after their cruises. MAL listened. Isn't that a good relationship, a for-profit company trying to satisfy its customers, and therefore give itself a better chance for making a profit? No Franz, none of us have been large corporation CEOs, but we aren't idiots either. Titles and degrees don't guarantee knowledge and lack of them doesn't guarantee lack of knowledge. Ever since you visited the AQ this spring, you have been more cognizant of pleasing the company rather than of providing an open forum which we've enjoyed for several years. Its your board, you make the rules. So be it. If anyone would ever like to discuss any DQ issues honestly with me, please email me, as I won't darken Franz's board with any more of my know -it- all observations regarding MAL or the current QUEENS. [email protected]

My oh my, where do I start?

First of all, I agree with Judy. There seems to be a mindset that we as the rabid, the very dedicated, MAL's best customers as I see it, should accept quietly and without any gnashing of teeth any little change that MAL chooses to do. Which we have, in spades...the discussion about the fate of the eagle got a little out of hand and that was due to the replacement being so butt ugly...but none of us threw up our hands and said "That's it! I'm never cruising again 'cause I didn't get to fly a kite!", No, we adapted, Mal listened and they adapted, thank you very much, and lo and behold, I booked even ANOTHER cruise for 2007. And the funny thing is, the 30 or so repeater couples and pairs that Deb and I have cruised with time after time again, most who do NOT visit here on this website, when we talk, even to this day, about the zillions of changes that MAL did, we all universally agree that we would still continue to cruise despite the changes made to THE EXPERIENCE. We all have, but didn't really know we had, the Pat Carr philosophy of DQ cruising, she just states it so perfectly. We all giggled over the fact that we would still cruise even if the LEGENDARY DELTA QUEEN were pink with purple polka dots...we'd be a little embarrased, but we'd still cruise.

Now here is what I don't understand. Franz, you talk about the business of publishing and how a higher price can be justified by exclusivity, and I understand your explaination. But, MAL publishes a rack rate of $600 per night for a "G" on the DQ for 2007, the rooms don't book and they lower the price at the last minute to what I suspect is below cost, just to fill the boat. Doesn't that negate your exclusivity argument...if MAL can justify selling less rooms at a higher price, to the point of overall selling LESS rooms per cruise, there would be no reason to go to the hassle of selling rooms at bargain basement prices at the last minute.

And here is the kick in the teeth, MAL's sharp stick in the eye to all it's best customers...For 2008 they advertise a two-fer early bird special for repeat passengers at...wait for it...the VERY SAME $600 a night for a DQ "G", the very same rate as last years rack rate, but now it's a SPECIAL RATE!

Does MAL think we are stupid? And you can guess by now what I think of their pricing...how do you attract anybody, new customer or your best customer by doubling the price of your product, price your product way higher than ANY of your competitors. $600 a night isn't selling at all in 2007 from what I gather, is something astronomical going to happen that I'm unaware of that sudden makes the very same $600 a night sexy and attractive?

MAL is putting lipstick on this pricing pig, and I'm insulted. What we all on this board suspect is that the prices have been pushed so high that NOBODY is booking cruises and we are saddened that we, as repeaters, will stop cruising if the pricing doesn't change AND, and here is the KEY issue... that the DELTA QUEEN WILL ALSO STOP CRUISING. That is why we as forum contributers are so vocal, and I will be the first to say the new prices are just asinine! And I'm sorry I just don't get it...I know I'm not a cruise market expert but these 2008 MAL prices when compared with the competition, both brown and blue water, both American and European, just make no sense to the uneducated me!

Now I DO agree with the argument that exclusivity can demand a higher price. But we ALREADY HAVE BEEN paying a higher rate for all these years. Think about how much we pay per square foot of stateroom floor space! Franz, you said it yourself...you, yourself want us to compare amenitites and stateroom size to the dollars paid when you decided not to ride the Queens anymore. We as customers have always agreed to pay more for less "Stuff". The dollars paid are paid for the experience, a now new and much leaner experience, but the experience none the less. The rest of it, down to the stupid robes, is just so much static to the experience.

Now everybody says MAL reviews the posts on this board. From what I personally heard from a MAL big muckedy-muck, MAL doesn't care too much for our little forum community. I sincerly hope that what I heard I heard wrong or that the statement I heard is one person's opinion...Anyways, if MAL is reading this here goes:

My wife and I sincerly enjoy your product. Your one "vessel", the DQ is the subject of a considerable portion of our conversation every day. We have made so many friends, both employees of yours and your customers, through your product. Our love for your product was one of the key reasons of why and when I decided to recently retire. My wife and I have decided that we have X amount of money to spend on Y days of vacation enjoyment. For 2007 that equated to 6 cruises with your company. For 2008 we had hoped it would be even more cruises on the DQ than in 2007. We are willing to pay more than we paid in 2007, just like we paid more this year than we did in 2006. For purposes of discussion, I will even admit and state what I consider to be fair value for the product...$400 a night for a bunkbed "G" stateroom, and that is for the room not per person. We will probably pay a little more than that if the cruise is truly unique, such as a new river or theme. However, if the cruise is not unique we would not pay the $400 per night, an example being the NOLA to Memphis cruises that we have done umpty-ump amount of times, but we would still book a non-unique DQ cruise IF THE PRICE WAS RIGHT.

And one more thing, if MAL is reading...I honestly believe that it ISN'T the DQ eagle missing that has us all in a lather, it's that what you put up in the eagle's place is so tacky. Come up with something that is elegant, says DELTA QUEEN on it, and I'm sure we'll all be fine with it!

Thanks for letting me vent...Ok, gang...bash away...

Alternatives

Until we can think of workable alternatives, please enjoy some photos from 2006 below.

Lil, let's consider offering your services as adjunct entertainment to showcase your mother's grandfather's years as a pilot on the DELTA QUEEN in the early years on the western waters. Didn't he write a book, or keep a log or diary, or draw some awesome, colorful charts of the Ohio River? Could you put together a slide show on a computer to show to the passengers some photos of the early years? You and your brother must have some entertaining stories to amuse the passengers, many of whom will have had never rode on a seamboat before.

Be sure to suggest that the company advertise that you will be on the Reunion/Race Cruise so that prospective passengers are more likely to book that expensive trip. Write that up as a proposal to submit to the company. Offer the services of the four of you for $16,000. (Helen Prater's piano-playing is worth that much all by itself!)

When the company man stops laughing, perhaps you all can compromise on an even exchange of two of the many empty rooms they will have.:) It will be a win-win deal.

Slowly, slowly, please. You completely got me wrong! The only thing I'm asking for is fairness.

Stop calling MAL managers stupid. Stop saying things you can't prove and where you probably just don't know the background.

I'm really sick of postings that are insulting anyone (and yes, that includes MAL managers as they're human beings as we all are, too). There is no need to write "what a stupid strategy is this" or "how stupid can MAL be" or anything like this. I simply don't want to read this any more as it doesn't help us in any, any, any way. full stop.

All what Judy and Bruno are saying in the two postings right in front of this posting is perfectly fine. Say what you think about high rates, etc. But don't pretent to know everything better than someone who has a lot of experience in this business, who gets paid for it and - very important - is also personally responsible for his actions.

Discuss what ever you want here and question what ever you want. But keep fair and stay out of personal insults. That's all I ask for and I'll execute this rule rigorously. I consider it as a personal insult if you call a manager's strategy "stupid".

Let me just have one example here, and Judy, please excuse me for using one statement from you - it's just meant as an example for many other statements in other postings from other posters: "So what did they learn? Absolutely NOTHING!" So how can you know this? This simply is not fair. You're assuming that how you think is the only right way to think and everyone else is too stupid to learn?

If you blame someone for something in the public, prove it or leave it. It's a simple rule of fairness not to accuse people and not prove what you pretend to know.

Bring your arguments, but don't insult people. There is no reason to become personal, there is no reason to insult someone for what ever reason in a public forum.

I fully understand that these new rates any many other things are not making you happy, to say the least. And everyone who knows me knows that I think pretty similar about many of these things. But again: Let's stay fair and decent, let's discuss our points and let's not insult others. Please.

Franz

I think if you re-read all of my posts Franz, I believe I haven't insulted anybody's management skills, decisions, or persona for a long, LONG time. I'm pretty sure I learned my lesson back when I had my one on one "discussions" with Bruce N., a long time ago. And you may remember, at that time, what I expressed toward DN's decision to rent the boats to FEMA... that sure worked for them didn't it? I believed that was the last time I called a management decision stupid on this forum...or words to that effect...and you were concerned then, and I agreed it was wrong.

Where I DID use the term "stupid" it was directed at objects, objects that in my opinion are stupid...maybe "silly" is a better word to use? I apologize for my comment about the robes, I didn't realize it would be seen as offensive...

The point of my post was my crude attempt to show somebody, anybody that there is a huge distance between the $600 a night they are asking for bookings in 2008 and the $200 a night they are charging now in 2007 just to fill the boats. Think there might be a happy medium somewhere? A happy medium that makes the boat run in the green? A happy medium that we repeaters would jump on with tons of deposit cash? It just seems that what we are being asked to pay for in 2008 is to answer to stockholders interests only, obviously this conclusion is MY guess, and is a personal opinion of only MYself. Some of us are in management, though, matter of fact quite a few of us on this forum are in management, I think we can pretty much connect the dots a little better than you give us credit for...and if I sound a little forward it may be that I believe I have somewhat earned the right to be forward with more than 65000 reasons over 7 seasons...also fear and sadness make people become more forward...

I guess I got to ask the ultimate question, as I have little faith in the statement that MAL monitors this board with a favorable light:

Is there any way to contact MAL directly other than the contact link on the MAL website, the contact link that the company never answers (at least when the Krause's ask a question)?

Bruno Krause;6136 wrote: I think if you re-read all of my posts Franz, I believe I haven't insulted anybody's management skills, decisions, or persona for a long, LONG time.

Bruno,

I was not talking about someone specifically, but in general. So please don't feel that this is targeted on you. It's not targeted on anyone but a desperate try to maintain the standard and style of discussion on the message board on a level I'm feeling comfortable with.

Obviously I still did make a very bad job in expressing what my point is in the previous postings. Maybe this is a language issue, or even a cultural thing 😉 I'll try again to make my point in a new posting ...

Franz

Okay, let my try again to explain what my point is:

Being the moderator of the message board I'm trying to separate opinions from moderation issues. It's very hard to be a moderator of a forum when at the same time you have your own strong optinion on topics you're moderating.

Asking for fair play doesn't mean I'm sharing one's opinion or not. This actually doesn't matter at all. But just because my opinion backs one of the other side (and the ones who know me better know where I'm standing!) doesn't give me the right to accept that anyone is being personally attacked or there are allegations about someone that can't be proven (or at least haven't been proven by the poster).

Again: It doesn't matter whether I'm sharing the opinion of someone or not. As moderator my job is to take care that everyone is treated fairly. That only things are being posted that belong into a public forum. And that, in conjuction with the latter, allegations made are being proven and not just rumors or gossip. That's my responsibility as moderator, as journalist, as publisher of the website - by law, by good manners and by personal decision about the style of discussion on this message board.

Discuss gossip and rumors and alike in private e-mails. A public Internet forum is not the right place for unproven statements, as much as it sounds likely that they're true. There are just things that do not belong in a public (!) forum on the Internet where it'll be available for almost ever to anyone typing in some keywords into Google. There are other ways of communication, like e-mails, for such things.

What I'm asking for as a moderator of the forum is to always think about what is suitable for a public audience, in compliance with the rules of fairness and also in compliance with the law. And probably the most important is how to present your opinion in the public.

What do I mean with "how to present your opinion"? Usually presenting your experience, your personal opinion (not conclusions!) is fine and fair - it's your personal view, not asking for generality. While conclusions always have the tendency of being dangerous for a lot of reasons.

Being a journalists for more than 20 years now, there is one simple rule by thumb that really works well, keeps you out of (legal) trouble and is very persuasive at the same time: Present the facts (facts!, not rumors, gossip, personal assumpions!) in a well ordered manner and leave the conclusions up to the reader. If you present your facts in a compelling way, you don't need to explicitely write down any conclusions because the reader will figure out by himself easily what the conclusion is. And more than that: When the reader makes this conclusion by himself, he subconsciously considers this as his own idea. How powerful is that over telling the reader what to think?!

The big difference is whether you're questioning someone's intelligence for adding some robes to the staterooms and asking for 100% rate increase or whether you simply present the fact that there are new robes and the price went up 100% while the food got worse (or whatever). There is simply no need to make the "stupid"-conclusion explicitely. Every intelligent reader is able to make this conclusion by himself. But for a posting on a public forum it makes the big difference between a fair, decent posting and an unfair attack.

If you find out that the way you want to write it or what you want to write is not suitable for being published on the Internet, send it as e-mail to your friends. That's why there is a difference between newspapers and private discussions at home - some things belong here and some things belong there.

I really hope my point is clear now. Again, please don't mix up the rules of fairness on a message board with what I as the moderator think about the topics discussed. These are two totally separate things.

Franz

OK Franz, point taken...sometimes it does take a sledgehammer to get through to me. I would hope that you can see that my intensions and my heart are really in the right place. I do love the old gal so! If I perceive that somebody is hurting her (again, in MY opinion 🙂 ), I lash out. German pride and all that...

Deb and I are really looking forward to meeting you and your family in Louisville. I suspect the discussions will be lively and very satisfying! The thing to keep in mind is that Deb, my very opinionated better half, has not expressed her thoughts on any of this, so far...she's saving it all for a face to face with you... 🙂 .

Bruno,

I'm also looking forward very much to meeting you in Louisville in August. Especially when it's about such difficult and emotional issues, person-to-person conversation in real life is such much better and easier than written computer text. It's said that 70% or so of human communication is non-verbal ... no wonder written e-mails and message board postings are causing irritations and misunderstandings all the time ...

Franz

Don't let Burno mislead you, You'll love Deb!! Actually you'll love them both. I just wish I could also be there too. What a great group will be there!!
Right now I just get to live the DQ through helping LInda work on her speech class "informational speech" she gives this week on -- what else?? The history of our fav. boat!! DQ forever!!
AAAUGH--I am too far away from the brown water!!!!!!!
Maybe I'll drive down to Sacramento and wander the decks of the Delta King for a "fix"
Miss ya all!
David & Linda Dewey

Even though I run a tiny business, I keep some basic rules in mind. The old sow "the customer is always right" for one. We also gear our tours to make them as enjoyable as possible so people will come back. That is why we don't do tours at 5:00pm in July, no matter how badly someone wants to. We have to make a living but we know better than to try and scalp people. They won't come back and we won't even be able to afford a cheap car. I do think large company executives have lost sight of this to some extent because they have their huge out of proportion salaries and perks and bonuses ad nauseum, so they don't worry if the company goes belly up because of their mismanagement. Look at the "New Coke" for example. That was a high paid blunder if there ever was one. At least MAL is listening and going back to some of the things they felt should be eliminated. Someone is listening. Now they just need to reinstate Vox Calliopus. I can't imagine a DQ cruise without the Vox Calliopus silliness.

Lexie- you are right but

it may not really be greed on the part of MAL. What if the prices are just starting high?

Personally, I think that Bruno (or anyone) might be able to negotiate to an extent. Although that is part of what I meant about pricing being crazy anyway and comparisons to the airline industry where every seat has a different price tag. Still, any company might be willing to discount if you committed to 3 trips instead of 1 or brought a group aboard.

Franz- I also think that you are right that none of us know the true marketing strategy anyway. Is MAL going to remodel the MQ and then try for more charter cruises to big alumni associations or sporting affiliations? Maybe that was just a Delaware North thing but Lexie's comment about high priced executives reminded me that many times they also get invited to be part of some big things like the "golf weekend" or whatever.

I think filling all of their boats all of the time would be very challenging indeed in today's economy. But that is the cornerstone for them.

Still can't afford it myself but that is not their fault- is it- that is my own fault.

Cheers
Elaine

PS Lil- maybe you can ask for a discount for Helen's great piano playing- or since we don't want to interfer with the entertainment- the super senior citizen discount.

I don't argue too much about the prices. I have checked on some other first class cruises, even Disney cruises, and they are not cheap. You get what you pay for. And being U.S. flag vessels, MAL cannot hire cheap third world labor, which translates slave labor, and other such "conveniences" that come with flags of, well, convenience. It's just darned expensive to run these boats, whether or not the organizational chart is top heavy. It's a fine line between what's too much and what's not enough.