Is the BELLE in trouble?

Hey Jim,

Bad timing to say the least on this "investigation". We've got similar drama, although not steamboat related here in the Queen City as there are plans in the works to bring parts of the U.S.S. Cincinnati (Retired submarine) to a city park. Many have already complained locally about budgets being tight and why do we need scrap from a submarine. Maintenance costs, etc. I know the BELLE has faced opposition in the past from tax payers. Hopefully the vast majority see the significance especially now with the loss of the MQ and the DQ tied up.
If anything was to happen I would hope that the city would part ways with the SOJ first. Sure she's more economical to run but think of all the tourism and convention business the Belle's capacity can handle. And with the newly installed a/c the weather shouldn't be an issue. Please keep us all posted Jim as this develops. Hopefully it will be put to bed quickly.

Aaron

hmm, unusual timing?

Considering they just spent megabucks installing the a/c last year, and considering that the passenger count was greatly increased last year, this seems an odd time to 'investigate'. We just got off the dinner cruise tonight which was packed. The dining room was full as were the outer decks. I didn't hear a passenger count, but it was healthy. Throw in the 100th anniversary festivities upcoming, and I'd say somebody has a burr in their saddle to 'investigate' this now!

Investigating the politicians salaries sounds like a better way to go to me. They've already ruined the next generation's chances of riding a REAL Steamboat overnight for weeks as a pax or months as a crewmember. To shut down an institution like the Belle, even if its just breaking even would be rediculous. Oh well, thats the Media, make a story of it no matter who it may hurt.

The WAVE, channel 3, report was just on. Perhaps somebody with more computer sauvy can put up a link to the report if WAVE puts it on their web site. The jeist of the report is that although the BELLE is an icon for the city and much loved, two years ago the BELLE lost $80,000, last year $110,000 and this year because of spring high water and Jebffboats bill the lose is estimated to be $250,000+. They were just asking the question "at what point does the city say they can't afford the BELLE anymore?"
There has been a persistant rumor that the city will keep the BELLE going through it's 100th anniversary and then call it quits, but that's just a rumor.
The report did mention that the boilers....which are going on 50 yrs...will have to be replaced in a few years at a cost of $500,000 to $900,000. Also Jeffboat is quitting the marine repair business and is selling its large drydock which means in 5 yrs. when the BELLE has to get drydocked again, she will have to go to either Huntington or Paducah.
Guess we'll have to wait and see what happens.

BELLE expenses

Nothing on the report about the high administrative expenses?

Here's the link

I don't know if the video is on here, but this is the text of the report:
Belle of Louisville losing hundreds of thousands of dollars - WAVE 3 News - Louisville, Kentucky

Judy: I wish we had a "LIKE" button on .org cuz I would press It for your comment (High Administrative Expenses) .. Just sayin. 🙂

"Liking" Judy's comment

I second that motion about the "Like" button for Judy's comment.

City Parks Don't Make Money.

From a city administration standpoint the Belle is essentially a city park. City parks do not make money for cities. Period. They are an expense. If Wave TV-3 is smart enough to figure out a way to get city parks to make money then I wish they would share that with the rest of the country. They would make me Mayor of Nashville if I knew how to do that!

HEAR, HEAR! Dead center hit, Ted! Sooner or later, the public may figure that the media are NOT in the business of bringing us the news, but that their real business is selling advertising! Can't sell advertising if nobody watches/reads...so, stir the pot! Cap'n Walnut.

Right, the Louisville/Jefferson County board of tourism (C-of-C, CVB, etc) needs to do a study of how many tourism dollars the Belle generates for them annually (directly and indirectly), and subtract that tourism income from the "loss" they see when they only look at the Belle's ticket income under a microscope...

They should find that the cost of operating the Belle is offset by the total tourism dollars gained, as visitors spend money elsewhere in the city. I know it's difficult to quantify tourism income, but I hope someone remembers this and comes forward with that data...

Sure, there will be some extra "red" on the Belle's balance sheet from last year's addition of air conditioning, but that has already proven to be a step in the right direction, with regards to increased ticket/charter sales.

Hopefully the powers that be won't make another wrong decision as they did with the Delta, Mississippi and American Queens. If it goes the way of the others, future generations may never know the sights and sounds of a genuine steamboat on our rivers. A fake steamboat without a real whistle or calliope just doesn't cut it.

Good timing on the installation of the air conditioning. Looks like the old BELLE is being taken for granted. Is Churchill Downs next? After all, t only has one big race a year.

Exactly the point I try to make to the Oroville City Council regarding the State Theatre Performing Arts Center that I am "temporarily" managing. It's an indoor park folks! It generates income by bringing people into town, who spend money and the city gets the tax income form them and the businesses that those folks support.
Getting off soapbox now!! (It's too slippery with all that soap!)
S'
David D.

Right-o, Steve-O. Just one thing to look at: the event at the Howard Museum this past weekend. How many hotel rooms were rented, how many dollars were spent on restaurant meals, parking, gas at local stations, etc., etc. from this one small event that would not have attracted as many people if the BELLE OF LOUISVILLE had not been one of the attractions? And we on this board know, as some in the local area do, too, that there are quite a few people who make it a point to travel to Louisville for the express purpose of riding the BELLE. I've done it, as have hundreds of others. Calculating her worth can be a hard thing, but worthy she is.

I can’t agree more with all of you and your opinions about the expose Eric Flack did last night on the WAVE TV-3 news. As a group we are very knowledgeable about steamboating and the BELLE OF LOUISVILLE’s plight.

I have to agree with Judy, there was no mention of anything to do with the costs associated with the Administration of the boat. Not to mention many other facts about its operation and things associated with it the public is not aware of.

The boat IS a sort of public park. Most people don’t realize the operation of the boat has such an effect on the local economy. They don’t see the hotel rooms filled up by her operation, the businesses who get customers from her existence, or the tourists who come to the city because she is here. The unfortunate reaction to silliness such as this one-sided expose’ is an uneducated response to stop the financial loss rather than to understand why it is happening or how her operation is a good thing for the community.

The Steamer BELLE OF LOUISVILLE was purchased by the City of Louisville and Jefferson County (KY.) in 1962. When purchased running her was not the plan. Many ideas were bandied about as to what to do with her. The reason she was purchased was to draw attention to the dying riverfront area of the city. She was put into the hands of the local Parks Department to determine what to do with her. As they didn’t know what to make of her, they developed an Operating Board comprised of the Captain of the vessel, local business professionals, and professional river people. This Operating Board determined she was a viable operation and set forth to getting her ready to run. Many hundreds of local dollars were poured into getting her into shape to operate and by the early 1970’s the boat was paying her own way and did not need a single local tax dollar to augment her operation.

This was the case through out the 1970’s and 1980’s. During this time period the boat was running a number of very popular cruises which had such a draw she was virtually running at capacity all the time. She ran Teen Dance Cruises, Saturday Night Dance Cruises, Locks Cruises, Oktoberfest Cruises in the fall, and narrated Public Sightseeing Cruises.

One of the biggest problems in the boat’s operation is the public conception of the boat. Since these themed cruises have all been cancelled (save for the Public Sightseeing Cruises), the public looks at her as a “been there, done that” kind of thing. Anymore, she attracts out of town guests predominantly.

In the 1990’s the County Judge Executive (Dave Armstrong) decided to help the BELLE along he would purchase another boat. He wanted a cheaper to operate diesel-operated boat, which would have air conditioning. This was to answer the chief complaint of the passengers of the BELLE. He purchased the HUCK FINN from Gateway Cruises, she was renamed SPIRIT OF JEFFERSON and was to run at the recently restored Farnsley Moorman home in the south west area of Jefferson County. She would be cheaper to operate, have amenities the BELLE didn’t, operate in an area of the County the BELLE didn’t, and help bring in revenue. This idea was only tried for a scant few years and never caught on with the public. Because of a lack of advertising and knowledge about this operation it was abandoned and the new boat was operated at the city front with the BELLE.

The BELLE and her sister boat the SPIRIT were losing money. The Operating Board was dissolved and the operation was privatized by the city, enter Hornblower Marine. Hornblower came into the picture with the idea the boats could make money with dinner cruises and set about making elaborate plans with local caterers and raising prices. All the while neglecting the fact Louisville is not a large-scaled tourist destination like the other towns they operate excursion boats in. This too, failed miserably, in part because the local citizens did not have a need for it, (at the time there was another boat very successful in a similar operation at the same landing, the STAR OF LOUISVILLE) and the number of tourists needed to support it just weren’t there.

Mayor Jerry Abramson decided to take bids to get another operator to take over the BELLE. BB Riverboats of Cincinnati was the most likely operator to take the operation over and news stories carried this likely outcome as an almost done deal when out of nowhere came an announcement that Waterfront Development Corporation was going to manage the boats.

Waterfront Development Corporation is a corporation formed by Mayor Jerry Abramson in, I believe, 1990 comprised of former Senator David Karem, and his friends to raise funds for, develop, and build a new waterfront park for the City of Louisville. As originally pitched to the taxpayers this Corporation would be given the entire waterfront from the Belvedere Park to the Big 4 Railroad bridge with the purpose of developing the land into a signature park to be the crowning jewel of the largest Parks Department in the nation. The city purchased land from Martin-Marietta Sand and Gravel, Ashland Oil, the Port of Louisville Terminal, and several other entities to make this happen, costing several million dollars.

Waterfront Development Corporation then began raising public, State, and Federal funds to fund its existence. Over the next 10 years the park grew and grew to become the crowning jewel of waterfront parks in the nation and the standard by which the waterfronts of many towns are now based.

In 2005, in their 15th year of operation, the Waterfront Development Corporation took over the operation of the BELLE OF LOUISVILLE and immediately started implementing changes to the operation of the boats. Keep in mind this Corporation has accomplished their goal, yet the land and accompanying park have not been turned back over to the Parks Department of the city…they continue to grow and take over more land for development and raise several million dollars a year to do so.

The main point Eric Flack missed in his expose’ are what Waterfront Development is doing with the BELLE and the fact they are who are operating her. This was not mentioned. Waterfront Development, along with our local Parks Department, Library system, and wonderful Zoological Gardens are all partially funded (if not entirely) by City funds. None of them turn a profit, nor were they designed to. The BELLE is being operated by the largest earning group of them all, Waterfront Development.

Of the points he did not make were the fact Waterfront Development is not a boat operation, nor have anyone in their employ ever operated an excursion boat. They are comprised of a former Senator and his friends to develop a public park . Like those at Hornblower Marine before him, they were ill-suited to successfully operate the vessels in this type of market.

Waterfront Development has taken their new charge seriously and utilized it to their advantage. They have added their name (a private Corporation) to the BELLE OF LOUISVILLE’s (a City-owned public operation) logo and utilized the boat in their advertising. They have also added links to their fundraising and the park to the BELLE’s website (Steamboat Belle of Louisville - Excursions, Dance Cruises, Dinner Cruises, Charters, Weddings on the Ohio River) which is funded by the state. The crew of the BELLE (while being paid in city funds) are required to take care of Waterfront Development land while on the clock. They clean the wharf from Belvedere Park to the Galt House Hotels, and east to Second Street. They are also required to maintain plant beds, garbage removal, and flood (high water) clean-up in these areas most of which are not associated with the operation of the boat.

One has to wonder how this use of the city funds for the park missed Mr. Flack’s probing cameras eye.

One also has to wonder how much of the Federal, State, and City funds secured for the BELLE’s operation are being directed into Waterfront Park activities.

Please do not take my statements to be a direct slam to Waterfront Development, the Parks Department of the City of Louisville, the Louisville Free Public Library, The Louisville Zoological Society, or the BELLE OF LOUSIVILLE. I merely intend my statements to bring about questions to help solve this situation for the continued operation of the BELLE and all the mentioned entities.

If Waterfront Development Corporation were truly interested in preserving the BELLE, would they not funnel their own funds into her continued operation? Would they not take notice of the danger of her location and move her into a safer position along their land? Many local citizens are not aware of the damage to the wharfboat (The MAYOR ANDREW BROADDUS) and the sister vessel (the SPIRIT OF JEFFERSON) in recent years after being sideswiped by towboats. None of these accidents were reported in the local news, yet both vessels spent considerable time in the shipyard while repairs were effected. When the City of Louisville built the new wharf in 1974, it was built over and out into the river from the original slanted cobblestone wharf. This puts the city-owned boats directly into the path of towboats and their barges heading into the Louisville and Portland Canal. It is only a matter of time before the BELLE takes a direct hit, too. With this target painted on her side, it is just plain dangerous to leave her where she is.

If Waterfront Development were so keen on the continued operation of the BELLE, would they not want to move her to the other areas of the park they have developed? The landing they build just below the Big 4 Railroad Bridge would be perfect for her….as would be the landing where the DELTA QUEEN and her sisters recently landed. Both of these would be perfect landing places for the boats and provide a safe haven for them from vessels navigating in the harbor, as well as put them in prominent places in the park where parking is available for the guests of the boat and the park, shade is available for the waiting passengers, and give the boats much better public exposure. This would be especially good for the SPIRIT, as she is currently hidden from public view and only seen when approaching the BELLE at her landing. At either of these up river landings the BELLE’s own advertising specialist, the calliope could be utilized properly to call passengers from the park, downtown, and the residential areas near the boat. As it is now, the calliope echoes off the expressway and is a hindrance to passengers on the landing, the boat, and the crew in the office trying to answer customer questions and the phones. Sadly, because of this reflective volume problem a recent verdict has been handed down by Waterfront Development and the calliope is rarely played and for much shorter periods of time when it is, another loss of her history and intended purpose.

Please take my statements here as a way of pointing out things that could be fixed and made better for a better operation of the boats to make more money. If the boats were better advertised, if they were offering cruises the public wanted to take (locks cruises, dance cruises with popular bands, other forms of entertainment), it they were in a safer location, and if they were operated by “boat people” who understand what she is and how to operate her, wouldn’t it just make sense she would need less public funds and be more, if not entirely, self sufficient?

Travis

Tourist income

Well, there isn't anything left to say about the BELLE's operation after Travis' excellent factual thought-provoking posting ( I think that would be a wonderful guest editorial, if they have such a thing in the Courier-Journal), but let me expand on Bob's comment about the tourism dollars brought in. Here is the tally for my River Ramblings weekend:
$269.18 hotel
21 Walgreens photo developing
36 sr. rate tickets 2 BELLE cruises
6 large drinks from BELLE concessions
43 2 meals at Kingfish
51 admission, purchases at Howard Museum Gift shop
10 parking for BELLE cruises
5 souvenir BELLE sign(really the NATCHEZ with DELTA QUEEN on it)
That's $441.18 I spent in the 63 hours I was in town. If I didn't already have most of the BELLE's souvenirs and items in the Howard's gift shop, it would have been a lot higher.

Its So Simple !

Greetings From New Orleans ,
" Its So Simple " , to resolve the possible and potential issues with the Belle , turn it into a money making venture ! For starts , get a new Marketing Manager and take a pro active approach to SELLING the Belle ( metaphorically) to the city , to the county , to the state , to the region , to the country and YES to the world ! You doubt me ? Well , Betty Blake did and I would imagine on a much smaller budget ! I firmly believe that anything that Govt. manages , yes even smaller Govt. even on a smaller scale , is simply wasteful and inefficient compared to private managers which can do it much better and much more efficiently !
First of all , I will be the first to admit that I am not familiar with all the inner workings of the present Belle Of Louisville management but obviously there is room for improvement or we would NOT be having this discussion !
Secondly , do the " Powers That Be " in the county really care about the Belle or simply look at it as a financial nuisance and have bigger financial issues at hand ? Furthermore , just possibly , if the Belle was managed and marketed correctly , it would be a money maker and NOT a money drain !
Last and foremost , does the revenues that the Belle generates off set its over head ?? Once again , I doubt it or once again we would NOT be having this discussion !
Its that simple !
Food For Thought !
Smooth Sailing !
Ted Davisson
WA-4141

Thank you Bob and Judy. From its inception in 2006, I have deliberately scheduled all of the RIVER RAMBLINGS programs during the summer months (despite the heat!) when the BELLE OF LOUISVILLE is operating public cruises -- and having the program at 3:00 PM to afford all who desire the golden opportunity to ride the historic steamboat on her afternoon cruise (12-2 PM) and then have plenty of time to drive over to the museum for an educational program on various river topics. From the outset, my intent has been to create an entire weekend of events that would appeal to steamboat buffs and buffettes who enjoy getting together for fun and fellowship. Each year, I am pleased that we have not only our local people, but many OUT OF TOWN friends and guests who attend the program and ride the BELLE, some of them arriving on Friday and staying over as late as Monday to ride the boat multiple times!

At the Howard Museum, we keep a plentiful supply of BELLE brochures on hand and heartily encourage our visitors to go take a steamboat ride! And as Judy and I have both been "preaching" of late, RIDE THE BELLE as MUCH as you can WHILE you can!!!! 'Nuf Said!!!!

When considering government operation of anything, there is an old saying that is generally correct: "Figures don't lie but liars sure can figure".

There is a riverfront park area next to the Belle. How much "profit" did it generate last year?

(1) A major "attaboy" to Travis for such a comprehensive review of this situation.

(2) What a lousy job by WAVE television in presenting this article....written as though the "Belle" is a bottomless money pit. No mention of the recently increasing passenger counts.....no mention of the staggering cost of fuel and its impact on the boat's financials.....no mention of the terrific amount of work done by a very small crew.

Travis' treatise

I have suggested to Travis that he get that published in the C-J as a guest editorial. Unfortunately media investigations usually start with a premise and they dig only in the areas that will substantiate that premise. "The BELLE is doing better" wouldn't have drawn many viewers...

Judy,

I not only did this, but replied to the comments of Mr. Flack's news story (on the WAVE TV-3 website) with a link to this thread. This morning there was a radio show on local Talk Radio about the BELLE and this situation. I tried to tune in and missed it. I would have gladly called in to champion the cause.

If my posting gets published in the Courier Journal (or on their website) I will post a link to it here.

Travis

Travis et al: I agree that your writeup should be published. Local tax payers need to know the facts. On this board, of course, you are preaching to the choir. I think that it might be a wee-bit more effective if dates were shown when the various forces took over. What is written is wonderful but it would, in my opinion, command a bit more respect if the dates were there. I agree with Keith's comments and the high cost of fuel impacted the bottom line both from the standpoint of getting pax to the boat and running the boat. The added energy burden of A/C has not helped that aspect either. Louisville has many attractions, but the BELLE OF LOUISVILLE is the only one that takes me there...unless you count the Howard Museum!