Topic starter
10/08/2011 3:44 pm
It never ceases to amaze me the speed of the old steamboats and how hard they ran them. Yesterday while I was roaming through the old photos at the photo archives I came across a picture of the EAST ST. LOUIS (ex VIRGINIA of cornfield fame) loading passengers here in Louisville. At the end of the stage was a sign that read:
Every Saturday
9:30 Depart for Madison
7:30 Return
Moonlight at 8:30
Can you imagine that..going to Madison (40 miles) having a shore stop and returning all in 10 hours. Then in a hour depart for a Saturday night Moonlight cruise.
I would say that was a good boat ride.
There were also some pictures I had never seen before of the CINCINNATI/AMERICA race which was from the Louisville wharf to Rose Island a distance of 14 miles and a note on the picture said the boats averaged 13 miles per hour on the race. Now that was really "pickin' um up and puttin' down".
10/08/2011 4:35 pm
Jim: And, that AMERICA/CINCINNATI race was up-stream too! Add mebbe a mile-an-hour to that, plus or minus. Cap'n Walnut.
10/08/2011 5:40 pm
Hoppin' Bob and All...
What about the CITY OF LOUISVILLE? In 1894 she made a record run from Louisville to Cincinnati in 9 hours and 42 minutes, which is a speed record that has never been equaled. Two years later, she made another record run when she traveled from Cincinnati to Louisville in 5 hours and 58 minutes... or about the same time the DELTA QUEEN could get to Markland Lock running flat-out from Cincy.
The CoL averaged about 22 mph on her record downstream run, btw.
Talk about the DQ... I saw her average 20 mph over a six-hour watch going downstream on high water on the Lower Mississippi.. and when the old came to running - she was a nag.
Ole Hoppin’ Bob averaged better than 13 mph against the flow of the Father of Rivers when she whipped the NATCHEZ in 1870. I’m a firm believer that some of those brag boats topped 30 mph at times. After all, they were the 747’s of their day, and only the railroad could best them for speed.
10/08/2011 5:58 pm
Old Gray Mare
Talk about the DQ... I saw her average 20 mph over a six-hour watch going downstream on high water on the Lower Mississippi.. and when the old came to running - she was a nag.
On our 1995 DQ cruise we wound up running upstream from Vicksburg with the AQ on a steamboatin' day due to a cancelled shore stop at St. Francisville. The AQ ran behind for most of the day until after lunch when she pulled up for a race. The race lasted back and forth for about an hour when finally the AQ pulled ahead, playing "Old Gray Mare" on the calliope as she passed us. That moment was one of the highlights of the trip, and survives on video tape..somewhere.
Wesley
11/08/2011 9:08 am
At the risk of tootething my own horn, I believe the present-day Natchez could do it. She easily knocks off 12 mph upstream in the New Orleans harbor. Between Louisville and Madison summertime current speeds do not approach those of New Orleans.
That one-hour turnaround is the big source of delay. C. F. Smith, BoL manager, often made that mistake and it was all eight deckhands, a porter and a maid could do to, "spruce up, the Bonanza," to quote Tommy Couch. We frequently were obliged to, "sweep the dirt under the rug," to make it.
11/08/2011 3:01 pm
I was wondering about that. Don't know if it's still the case, but the Natchez usually only ran on one boiler, to boot. When she made her trip upriver, it was "ho hum, no big deal, what current?" as she zizzed past the towboats.
11/08/2011 4:12 pm
She may very well be able to do that today, Alan, but what about before the dams on the Ohio? Also, at times the current in the NOLA harbor is next-to-nothing, as about now with 4 or 5 feet on the New Orleans gage. If you catch it at the right time with the tide coming in and an east wind, the current completely dead in a good many places, not just in eddies.
As far as those one hour turnarounds go, I can't even imagine that on a boat the size of the BELLE. It was murder on a 100 ft. 400 pax boat, and we used leaf blowers to blow the popcorn off the deck.
11/08/2011 7:01 pm
The Racehorse of Western Rivers
Yes, Lexie, she does still use just one boiler - always has, even in races, even the one against the AQ. And while the current can be as little as Bob says, it can also be a heck of a lot more. Back at Tall Stacks '06 when the river rose quickly, there wasn't any question that the NATCHEZ could continue to run. She did sit out the one trip as did everyone else, but then they basically said they were going to run whether the others did or not. They knew she had the power and handling ability to deal with the conditions which weren't as bad as what she ran often in NOLA. And yes Alan, I think she could do it, but we'll never know...
11/08/2011 8:26 pm
I was aboard the Natchez for a cruise during Tall Stacks 2006. It was awesome!
You can see a bunch of pictures I took of it, and uploaded to flickr here:
Tall Stacks 2006 - a set on Flickr
-nick
15/08/2011 10:59 pm
If I were to pit any two steamboats against each other I'd like to see the City of Louisville against today's Natchez. Would anyone lay bets on that contest?
19/08/2011 7:48 pm
The City of Louisville was easily capable of 18-20 miles per hour. It averaged over 16 mph on its two record runs, one against and one with the current. Even so, I wouldn't bet a nickel for either boat!
21/08/2011 5:39 pm
*RE: CITY OF LOUISVILLE speed/Later events.*
Hi, Alan & Steamboating colleagues:
First, hate to jump a thread finding Keith's information/photos RE: events at the Howard Museum exciting. Keith, and the gang, have done a spectacular job and I can't wait to see 'the little museum that can--and does.'
Much sholarly research found in WAY'S PACKET DIRECTORY RE: CITY OF LOUISVILLE [Entry No. 1095 Pg. 93] in additon to facts, figures, memories in Capt. Ellis Mace's book 'Steamboats and Steamboat Men,' Cynthiana Press, 1941. This informative book rare as hen's teeth due to rather poor printing paper stock, binding at the time. If you see a copy grab it when you can. A few of Mace's time figures for the runs off by just a couple of minutes. This, no doubt, due to passage of time, memories on his part.
The COL built to replace the famed FLEETWOOD. Fred Way's figures are: 304 X 42 X 7 ft. Engines new from 'Frisbie' at 30 X 10 ft. stroke. Mace recounts the COL power so great she developed trouble holding her timbers, fore and aft bulkheads giving way 'under pressure.' Returned to the ways with heavier bulkheads reinforced with iron. Irons sheets placed edge-to-edge and bolted to the bulkheads. When found to 'hold,' Engineer Henry McClanahan 'let her run.' 1. Louisville to Cincinnati: 9 hrs. 42 minutes. 2. Cincinnati to Louisville: 5 hrs. 58 minutes. Mace opined if river lower at 30 ft. she could have shaved off no less than '40 minutes' on the first run.
Her fast run caused an uproar here in Cincinnati and down river with fleets, docks etc. banged and run awash with water. Laidley was called to account by river interests with a formal decision being given. Verdict was that the L&C LINE had a right to run the said boat in 'right of trade...business.' Other river interests advised to secure their fleets and equipment in a safe manner accordingly. Ole Laidely won that one and we can almost see him puffing his cigar with a grin in his office here.
Though Ladiley's pet/pride and joy, the COL proved not the big financial success he anticipated due to higher operating costs of some hundreds of dollars more a month--no doubt in the thousands today at present curency exchange.
Ellis Mace until his end countered many prevailing opinions critical of Commodore Laidley. "He was often misunderstood...many not realizing what he was attempting to do." Mace did admit that "Commodore Laidley often treated his enemies better than his friends." A spin on the idea of 'keep your friends close--but your competition and adversaries even closer.' Yet I wished I could have met Laidley if just once. Well, what do I know?
R. Dale Flick
Coal Haven Landing, Ohio River, Cincinnati.