American Queen

Hey Bob,
To answer your question about Sutton being the Master of the AQ, no. He is our port captain. About the wheel being chained down, well didn't need to turn it for this trip. Z-drives handling the vessel very well. The AQ will be winterized for the layup. All liquids drained and sollutions put into place to prevent pipes and toilets from bursting. It will go through layup in STL area, while the DQ and MQ will do their layup in Mobile, AL. The dry dock, once located in NOLA that handles these vessels have been moved there. The shipyard in NOLA is doing so much new work that they are not interested in lifting the boats for their hull inspections.
It is just speculation, but I figure that when we finish the last cruise of the season, we will depart NOLA that evening and bust over to Mobile before the navigation crew is dismissed or as they say, terminated.
Jim Davis

So, Wood River is the ultimate destination. It seems that this is the most popular choice for slumbering current and past passenger vessels. When she get there, I'll have to go and take a look at her, if it is possible to see. I was hoping that the boat would be tied up south of Downtown St. Louis, so it would be visible from the excursion boats.

Diesels?

Diesels? I was under the impression that all three of the Queens were steam powered paddlewheelers, especially since they all have steam whistles.

Thanks, Jim, I didn't know he was Port Capt. I knew about the wheel/Z-drives; was merely posting that the wheel was not in use for the edification of those here on the board.

Hi, Richard. The AQ is and always has been a hybrid boat. The steam plant is usually operational, and she has engines from the USCE Dredge KENNEDY. Being such a large boat, the diesel-electric Z-drivesadd both power and speed to the baot while underway, and greatly improve the handling of the boat in close quarters. It is my understanding the steam engines/paddlewheel will push the boat, but not very fast.

On her trial run in NOLA, she made 2mph on steam/paddlewheel alone. Her main power is the z-drives. On her first UMR trip in ?95/96, she wasn't a steamboat at all, as her paddlewheel shaft had cracked near Memphis and they had her wheel tied up, as it is now apparently. They didn't have any spotlights on the wheel up here, and probably most people didn't even notice it wasn't turning. She made normal time on diesels alone. Her steam whistle is blown only on rare occasions. For most of the signalling, the airhorn is used instead. I believe at least in the beginning, if not now, the General Jackson had a steam whistle too, but she is definitely no steamboat, all diesel propulsion. They had a small boiler hooked up to the whistle.

I was on the sixteeen day maiden voyage,or the first paying passenger trip. When we departed Saint Francisvile we headed up river. After traveling a few miles up river the Z drives were turned off to find how fast she would go only using the wheel. The boat was able to do about four miles per hour.

Northbound in the Mississippi current? four miles per hour isn't bad just using the wheel... Considering the Lower has I think 5 mile an hour current... dead water she could do 9 which is very good time on the river. Well, it is for towboats.

Also... Judy... when she broke her wheel... was that the same trip when she hit the sandbar?

No, the sandbar was on the Ohio River her first year. The cracked shaft happened later at Memphis on a NOLA-Memphis cruise, but offhand I can't remember if it was the same year or the next.

Whistle

Her steam whistle is blown only on rare occasions. For most of the signalling, the airhorn is used instead. I believe at least in the beginning, if not now, the General Jackson had a steam whistle too, but she is definitely no steamboat, all diesel propulsion

We are booked on the AQ for 2007 because she is scheduled for the upper Ohio River at the time of year that we will be available to travel. One of the things I was expecting was that the whistle, and not the horn would be used. How often has the whistle been used, and what would be a reasonable expectation? Does the whistle sound when making scheduled landings?

What does she do "hooked up"?

What about the boiler repairs???? I thought that one of the main reasons the boat was not operated this year was due to boiler damage that occured last winter. Has the boiler been repaired? If not are they going to do it this winter during the lay-up?
Mike's, Inc. is a good place to get diesel engines overhauled.
Why would anyone want to take a complicated plant such as the AMERICAN QUEEN to the frigid north while the other two boats are languishing in the balmy waters of Mobile Bay?
With our simple towboats one of our biggest worries during the winter lay-up is keeping the boats from freezing up. Wonder what kind of chemical they will use in the piping and what they'll do to get rid of it next spring when the boat comes out.
How do they winterize those big Great Lake ore carriers which lay-up all winter in places like Milwaukee, or do they keep heat on them all winter?

Judy Patsch wrote: No, the sandbar was on the Ohio River her first year. The cracked shaft happened later at Memphis on a NOLA-Memphis cruise, but offhand I can't remember if it was the same year or the next.

The paddlewheel shaft break became evident during a NOLA- Memphis trip in August of the AQ's first (1995) season. I returned from vacation in Memphis, and Marine spent all day wiring up the wheel to prevent it from turning. We called a special meeting for all passenegrs the next morning in the Grand Saloon, where Capt. Keeton & Chief Pete Jordan explained the situation. I'll never forget, when Capt. Keeton turned the mic over to Pete, his first words were, "If she'd a been a horse, I'd a shot her." ( By the way, sure do miss your great chocolate chip cookies, Judy... if they gave medals for helping Steamboats, you'd have a really big one...

The A.Q.s cracked shaft was noticed by a high bearing temperature alarm. As Judy mentioned the boat was just below Memphis. It was the last day of the second passenger paying trip. It was July 19, 1995.The wheel was supported with cables, the underwater bucket boards were removed. On August 18th and 19th even while the boat was under way to Louisville from Cincinnati her cranks were cut off.When in Louisville, a land based crane removed the cranks and they were taken by truck to be fitted on the new wheel being made.It was November 9, 1995 a scheduled turn over day in New Orleans the first wheel was removed and the new one put on.

Thanks for clearing the timing up - those first couple of years are such a blur without going back into my 'pilefiles'...and that could take a couple of years! I drove down to Muscatine for my first view of the AQ, and she was so huge and resplendent that, wheel turning or not, it was impressive. Patty Young was aboard, and graciously gave Mrs. Bill Foley and me the grand tour the following day up in Dubuque. Speaking of Patty, I know she's back in Ohio, has anyone heard from her lately? And thanks for the cookie compliment - I figure I'm over 28,000 now, which of course includes many for the NATCHEZ and other entities such as Arsenal Island police, Government Bridge operator, lockmen at 15... the keys to the kingdom. Its a strange summer with only one steamboat round trip, but the MQ will be spending most of the fall up here to keep the oven going, and preferably without any postmidnight hospital runs!

AQ now in St. Louis

The American Queen is now in St. Louis, passing through around 6:00 PM.

Jim, as far as I know (which is limited!) "wintering" on the lakes is usually crunch time for boat repairs... The inner basin in Milwaukee usually does not freeze over, and lately the layups have been minimal, especially with Milwaukee's large salt depots...
In Racine, Palmer Johnson used to winter several large "yachts" on the Root River...they would use submersible "fountain pumps" to keep the water moving around the boats... The river would ice over except around the dock...

I'd check on http://www.boatnerd.com as I can do is speculate! ;+)

News from St Louis: The American Queen entered lock 27 at 19:25 today,8/8/06, in route to Mike's facility in Pool 27 UMR , Wood River, IL. Maybe we can get up there to welcome Capt Sutton and crew to their new home. At least we now know where She is.
John

General Jackson's Whistle

The General Jackson uses a 3 bell chime whistle, made by Kahlenberg Brothers of Two Rivers, WI. It can be blown on either steam or air, but for all practical purposes it is actually a steam whistle.

I have corresponded with Gaylord Entertainment of Nashville where I had to tell them that it is in fact a steam whistle on their General Jackson. At the time of my correspondence they said it was not a steam whistle, since it was blown on air. A small boiler would not do this whistle justice, as it would require lots of steam. The same is true for air. If blown on air, this whistle would need a large compressor and air receiver of at least 200 gallons or larger.

Judy Patsch;919 wrote: On her trial run in NOLA, she made 2mph on steam/paddlewheel alone. Her main power is the z-drives. On her first UMR trip in ?95/96, she wasn't a steamboat at all, as her paddlewheel shaft had cracked near Memphis and they had her wheel tied up, as it is now apparently. They didn't have any spotlights on the wheel up here, and probably most people didn't even notice it wasn't turning. She made normal time on diesels alone. Her steam whistle is blown only on rare occasions. For most of the signalling, the airhorn is used instead. I believe at least in the beginning, if not now, the General Jackson had a steam whistle too, but she is definitely no steamboat, all diesel propulsion. They had a small boiler hooked up to the whistle.

Richard: It is not necessary to have a boiler big enough to supply a steam whistle or any other periodic swing load, if you put an accumulator in the line. Lets say that you calculate the steam load for a whistle that size. Most steam whistles seem to sound better on low pressure steam...say 35 psi. Put a pressure reducer between the vessel and the whistle valve in a properly sized line. Picking numbers out of the air, size the accumulator for, say, fifty gallons and charge the accumulator with say 25 gallons of water. Hook a small boiler of, say, 2 1/2 gallons of water capable of producing 120 psi steam to the accumulator (MISSIE's little boiler would do it) and turn it on when you anticipate usage. The 120 psi steam will enter the accumulator until the water is heated to a bit over 340 degrees F (saturation temp of 120 psi steam). There will now be several gallons of water more in the accumulator (considered an unfired pressure vessel) at that temperature and 120 psi pressure. When the whistle valve is opened, the pressure will drop in the accumulator and additional steam will evolve instantly from the 340 degree water until the temperature drops to 260 degrees F...supplying 35 psi steam all the while. I'm too lazy to do the real math but, starting with a known demand, all can be figured. The accumulator has to be well insulated but it can be done. I engineered such a rig in Denver some 25 years ago and it worked off of a flash boiler that was a tiny fraction of the instantaneous periodic demand on the system. The energy is stored in the water, not as vapor in the jug. There are reasons why management might not want such a rig aboard, and that equates to hiring personnel who know what they are dealing with and have a license to do so. Is it a bomb, waiting to go off? No more so than any steam boiler storing that much hot water. Should it rupture, it will seek a new home! Just one of the reasons that diesel power abounds on the rivers.

Kahlenberg 3 Chime

The accumulator sounds like a good idea, although most steam whistles won't give very much volume at 35 PSI without a modification to their languid plate, in which case they can blow as loud as if on 150 PSI-and at a much higher efficiency. You can learn how to make modifications like that at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/steam-whistles The stock 3 chime Kahlenberg on the General Jackson is rated at 50 PSI minimum and would not compete with the air horns at 35 PSI unless so modified.

Tom Schiffer;1007 wrote: Richard: It is not necessary to have a boiler big enough to supply a steam whistle or any other periodic swing load, if you put an accumulator in the line. Lets say that you calculate the steam load for a whistle that size. Most steam whistles seem to sound better on low pressure steam...say 35 psi. Put a pressure reducer between the vessel and the whistle valve in a properly sized line. Picking numbers out of the air, size the accumulator for, say, fifty gallons and charge the accumulator with say 25 gallons of water. Hook a small boiler of, say, 2 1/2 gallons of water capable of producing 120 psi steam to the accumulator (MISSIE's little boiler would do it) and turn it on when you anticipate usage. The 120 psi steam will enter the accumulator until the water is heated to a bit over 340 degrees F (saturation temp of 120 psi steam). There will now be several gallons of water more in the accumulator (considered an unfired pressure vessel) at that temperature and 120 psi pressure. When the whistle valve is opened, the pressure will drop in the accumulator and additional steam will evolve instantly from the 340 degree water until the temperature drops to 260 degrees F...supplying 35 psi steam all the while. I'm too lazy to do the real math but, starting with a known demand, all can be figured. The accumulator has to be well insulated but it can be done. I engineered such a rig in Denver some 25 years ago and it worked off of a flash boiler that was a tiny fraction of the instantaneous periodic demand on the system. The energy is stored in the water, not as vapor in the jug. There are reasons why management might not want such a rig aboard, and that equates to hiring personnel who know what they are dealing with and have a license to do so. Is it a bomb, waiting to go off? No more so than any steam boiler storing that much hot water. Should it rupture, it will seek a new home! Just one of the reasons that diesel power abounds on the rivers.

Bob Reynolds;901 wrote: I met the AMERICAN QUEEN at about 6:30 this morning at mile 26 on the Upper. They were upbound (deadhead) to Wood River, IL where the boat will be laid up at Mike's, Inc. along with the PRESIDENT. Spoke with Capt. John Sutton who said "he" was going to do some things about lay-up...is he Master on her? He said they were going to overhaul all three diesels on her. The boat looked pretty good -- one stack up, one stack down, and the wheel was tied down, not turning.

Captain Sutton, was over all 3 boats when DQSC was owned by DNC, he knows all the fine details about all 3 boats. The reason why the wheel was tied is because when you leave the boats sit up for a long time the condensation in the cylenders of the steam engines start to rst out the cylender walls causing pitting. also I'm sure the boilers were in the same condition. So they were running off of the Z drives instead of compromising the steam engines.