The future of S and D

S&D

The next Reflector we receive will be the Winter 2009 (formerly called the December) issue .

I received my S&D renewal notice and had the very same thoughts as you. My personal opinion is that 2 Reflector issues a year would be a bit "sparse" to hold my interest.

While I have really enjoyed the S&D meetings at Marietta, I am not able to get away and travel there as often as I would like... I think a number of people would agree that the Reflector is the publication that keeps all members informed, and is the "voice" of the organization. The Reflector is something I really look forward to receiving.

That said, it is disappointing to have seen the frequency and timeliness of this important publication go down the tubes since 2006. For me the Reflector is the main reason for paying dues. It is a significant part of the "dividend" of belonging to the organization. For institutions like libraries and musuems, the Reflector publication is the part of S&D they know and depend on (not the annual meetings).

For decades the Reflector did so well on its original December, March, June, September schedule. It is sad that it seems no longer possible to keep a timely quarterly schedule. I know other members (myself included) have discussed ideas with board members, but I am not sure what the current status is on this...

Aaron,

I dropped my S&D membership in 2009. As much as I miss the Reflector...I never got my last 2008 Reflector (I guess it serves me right)! The organization I was so proud to join in 1978 isn't the organization it is today.

With the loss of Capt. Fred Way Jr., Woody Rutter worked hard to step up to the plate. He put years of experience to use and created a great Reflector. However, the rest of the organization started to fall apart. Mostly due to keeping things the same with no change or willingness to adapt to the modern world. No one will ever replace the "Old Man"!

I have to admit, I had great hopes when Jerry Sutphin came in to the Presidency. He added new life to the whole thing with progressive things like web pages, moving the annual meeting to a place (easier to get to and from, which would have guaranteed more attendance). However, he moved too fast and scared the "old guard" into fast decisions to slow things down to a snails pace. This has been the undoing of a great organization.

I too realize my comments won't be popular with many people still working on keeping the dream of S&D alive. If I didn't see them as the truth and hadn't had MANY discussions where this was the outcome several times over...I wouldn't post this as my conclusion. Scientifically speaking, it is a sound and just set of statements!

S&D isn't dead...it is dying a long and painful death. It can be saved!

Like Judy and Steve have said, get the Reflector back on track. How about getting the membership roster back on track with other river activities in conjunction with some of the adjunct associations like O&K and MOR? If there was an annual outing to a steamboat (like the BELLE OF LOUISVILLE or NATCHEZ) it would provide for exposure to get more people interested and join in (like the boat crews, their friends, and the steamboat fans they come into contact with in their seasons). That would get the fire back in the boilers! Lets face it, most of the movers and shakers in S&D are sadly gone. We need new eyes full of excitement and commitment to step up to the plate and get S&D back out there (Aaron?)!

So before I get flooded with hate mail and slanted derogatory comments...let me say, I am not lamenting the loss of S&D....far from it. I want it to come back and be the organization I waited by the mail box to get a membership card from . I want it to thrive and fill my mail box with excellent historic photographs and expert commentary from professionals educating me with the history of the river that I can't get enough of!. I want to be there at meetings and have the opportunity to talk to like minded people about my love, the river. But, I am not paying another dollar to support the dying elephant that S&D has become when even the Management of it proudly state "it is okay just as it is".

When it is showing signs of life again, I am there with my $30.00 in hand!

What we need is a President who will get us out to do activities, meetings, and recruit new membership, we need a Treasurer who will respond to membership requests and get the information out there in a timely manner. We need a house organ like the Reflector, one we can count on like clock work to get the information out there to us on what is coming around the bend that we can learn about, see, and do! We need signs of life and not tired, threatening words posted by the "old guard" (who don't seem to understand that in this modern, instant gratification world we don't have time for "when and if get around to it" management of the group...it isn't good enough anymore).

Capt. Fred Way Jr, C.W. Stoll, Woody Rutter, and Bee Rutter were able to do it with out internet, faxes, cell phones, laptop computers, or even electric typewriters...and I KNOW our generation can do it too. We have the tools to do it better than they did...we have the ability to make it greater than they did, we have the benefit of their experience and knowledge along with the technology.

So why aren't we doing it?

That is my challenge...let's see what we CAN do with it! Lets stop saying why we can't do this, why we shouldn't do that, why they didn't do it that way before, and make it what it SHOULD be in THIS day and age.

As my Mother used to say (paraphrased for sensitive ears) "if you ain't gonna use it...get off the pot!"

Travis

P.S. Send your hate mail to [email protected]

No hate mail from me. I agree with you 100%. It seems as if somebody up there just doesn't get it. They are people I respect and have known a long time, but there seems to be a wall in there somewhere.

No hate mail here either. I renewed out of hope. . .
This problem seems to be in many organizations nowadays--is it a sign of the times, the next generation coming up with no interest in the past beyond when Pac-Man started?
It seems that all the things I am interested in are going by the wayside; Steamboats, Antique cars (NOT Hot Rods), Pipe Organs, Player pianos, toy trains, Steam trains. . .
Calliopes too.
I don't have any answers, but it sure seems that with today's technology, the Reflector should be easier to put together than ever--AND it is what keeps folks who live way far away from muddy water in the organization--4 times a year should be the minimum!
S'
David D.

Fish Fry This Fall

There was the time, since becoming a member in 1957 or '58, that the S&D Reflector followed me all around the country to Kentucky, Arkansas, California, Mississippi, Illinois, and even half-way around the globe to Seoul, Korea, and I could set my calendar by the timely arrival of that good publication. As a very-long-time member I sadly agree with all of what has been posted here.

The Reflector is the real meat of the organization and the main reason I wouldn't mind paying such high dues if the mag appeared magically four times a year at my gate post. Otherwise, I'm beginning to wonder. If S&D wants to continue as an organization, then I agree that there will have to be changes made.

If at all possible, however, I will give it my best shot to be at this year's annual meeting to hear "Fish Fry" give his celebrated talk on the AVALON.

I am in another organization that is having the age problem, and it has nothing to do with things of the past. It is, in fact, a women's educational organization, but the younger women are doing something else or are not joiners. They are trying to address the problem, however, and not stick their heads in the sand.

I recently participated in a career fair for high school students and was underwhelmed by the response. It was almost like I was invisible. Here's what drew them in: climbing ropes, a T-shirt designer giving out free t-shirts, food, and, last but not least, getting tazed by an irresponsible sheriff's deputy who got talked into doing this by the kids. They may be 17, but they have the maturity of a 9 year old.

I was representing 2 careers: Graphic design and the river. It was a rushed up thing so I didn't have any bells and whistles. Yo! If I could hook up a whistle to a little boiler, that would get their attention!

Yea, it would be nice to be able to attend that meeting.

Do you think that the Reflector should continue on with its strongly historic format? Should it have more member input? Yes, it would be a piece of cake to email articles to the publisher, etc., but getting the basic info together seems daunting. Trying to emulate Fred Way's Reflector is a total impossibility in most of our minds. It is going to be darned hard for almost anyone to do, except maybe Alan Bates. So I figure that if more people were involved in its publication, it might have a better chance. Times change and we cannot ignore that fact. and WE, not "them", are now carrying the torch.

I work with a group of under 21's in a "Hospitality training" setting. Of the group, only 2 have what I would consider a traditional work ethic. Mind you, they're good kids, but their view of the world and what it is about is almost 180 degrees from mine. The two with the ethic get pretty upset with the rest of the bunch too--and with the management of the training company (whom I work for, but frustratingly so!--the kids are right!).
S'
David D.

One of the suggestions I made over a year ago to help get the schedule back on track was to have perhaps 4 members each responsible for an 8 page section of one issue. These would be tied together by the editor so that he would not have had the responsibility of researching and writing all the material. I could have easily done 8 pages on Streckfus, for example, replete with new photos. I'm sure there would have been at least 3 other volunteers. You see where that suggestion went... several of us have made suggestions and offers to help, to no avail. So...

pity the editor.
I bet I know why the S & D comes out late. It is the lack of Articles. Some of you out there likely have ideas for good articles so put pen to paper or in this age fingers to key board and send David K Smith Editor S & D , P.O. Box 1323, Ashland, Ky, 41105 something to print. I have a boring paper on one of my computers, a list of boats that went up the Illinois River in 1844. It would be a little different then the usual S & D material It has a description of the boats and who the captains and some of the clerks were.

As for young blood, I don't have the answer it is a problem for the Missouri River Rats Reunion and the River Buffs at Keokuk as well.

Utah River Rat formerly on the Dredge Lewis at Brownville, Nebraska.

I confess to having a desire to edit the S&D Reflector, but by the time Woody resigned I found myself writing the Old Boat Column in the Waterways Journal. We must remember that Fred Way was also a newspaper writer accustomed to that holy-of-holies, meeting deadlines. He had collected the materials to publish about a long period of time. He knew that steamboat history is not a record of hull sizes and stack heights, but is a chrionicle of people. His parents had the good judgment to bear him in time to know the old-timers about whom he wrote. That combination of information and talent is not given to everyone.

People are not as individualistic as they were in the old days. Orneriness then consisted in fighting, bullying, loving this and hating that, all with passion. That passion has been pressed out of rivermen and all Americans, but here are passionately devoted men on the river today who never smelled cylinder oil. Diesels have been around long enough now that the Mississippi Valley is loaded with their retirees who share the history, nostalgia, loves and hatreds that the rivers have always engendered kin rivermen's lives. The word "steam" does not appear in the Reflector's title.

The S&D was founded to provide a meeting place for old rivermen to share their memories, their boasts, and, yes, their humorous lies. It is time to bring in retired rivermen of today along with their boats to fill the pages of the Reflector. They may not recall the sound of the Island Queen's whistle, but they have had interesting lives, and tales to share. Captain Smith has made an effort in that direction and needs the help of those who want to retain the Reflector and the organization.

If you want to continue its publication - CONTRIBUTE!

Don't think I won't. In the past I was too busy running a steamboat to contribute anything, but I have tons of material on the Red River (South), Texas rivers, and Arkansas rivers, and I know very little of this subject has been in the Reflector. But as Judy says, she got a deaf ear when she proposed something like that a year ago. Have things changed any?

I only made a few trips on modern towboats, but the stories are there. "Things" do still happen on the river. Those 2 trips were adventures just as surely as they would have been 50 or 100 years ago on an old steamboat. They had their moments of humor and excitement and "oops!". I think Bob Reynolds could make a good chronicler of the present day river. He has a way with words and notices quirky little things about people. After he left the DQ, he was working on some little coon-ass boat on the ICW, and sent me a copy of a list of supplies that the captain needed, using the captain's spelling. Nary a word was spelled correctly, Cajun spelling, I guess, and it was really funny. Fred Way funny.

I don't think its a lack of article problem. As I understand it the editor has plenty of material on hand. For a couple of years now, I've been contributing a column about model steamboats titled "Small Stacks". It didn't appear in the Fall 09 issue and I understand it is not in the just published Winter issue which I haven't received yet. The editor has it - I sent it twice. It was about the new maritime hall in the Smithsonian. I put a lot of effort into those columns. Sorry, there wil be no more until this one is published.

No Pity the Editor

Carl, you're always dead on with your postings, but not this time. There has been plenty of material sent to the editor, just as there was to prior editors. I have sent several things, some of which have appeared. But like John, I won't send any more. Once I had to resubmit an entire article and pictures because the editor's hard drive crashed. OK, that happens. I would have thought a backup would have been done for such a project. But I gave it a pass. Then a couple of issues later, the excuse for the tardiness was that the editor's hard drive had crashed - again. Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me!
In a previous posting I mentioned a suggestion I had made to help get the magazine back on schedule. It was ignored. Well, here's another suggestion I had made, also in file 13: Pay an editor. With what? With money from the J. Mack Gamble Fund. I don't know the balance now, but when I was on the Board of Governors, there was sufficient money there. Instead of giving grants to other 501c s for projects, use our own money to help keep our organization viable. Back when Woody retired, we had a member who was both knowledgeable in river and steamboats and who had edited/written several books. If the editorship had been a paid position, I suspect she might have accepted it, but she is now established in a fulltime position elsewhere. But that doesn't mean there isn't someone out there who has the river knowledge, the computer/editorship skills, AND THE TIME to edit the Reflector who would do it on a paid basis...

Our thoughts be with you and your family, Capt. David

While we have been having a lively discussion here regarding the Reflector, we need to pause and offer our prayers and thoughts to Capt. David Smith. Today his brother Greg drowned on the Kanawha River. Regardless of our feelings about the Reflector, I think we all join in to offer Capt. Smith and his family our condolences on this sudden and tragic death of Capt. Greg.

Judy,

I, too receved this horrible news and my heart and prayers go out to his family at this terrible time!

Travis

What tragic news. David, My deepest sympathy to you and your family on the loss of your brother. Our prayers are with you.

This doesn't only happen with the Reflector. I once submitted an article to a train hobby magazine, and they even paid me ($35, as I recall--enough to pay for a subscription for two years!) but it has never been published--and, of course, I can't submit it to anyone else now!
S'
David D.

It is awful news that nobody wants to hear. I heard about it yesterday but not who it was, just that a boat sank at mile 37 on the Kanawha and one man was missing and the other swam to shore. Sincere Condolences to the Smith family.

AJ Richardson;21092 wrote: Hi All,

I received my renewal information yesterday for S and D and it really made me stop and think about renewing. I have always enjoyed being a part of the S and D family but I am concerned about the future of the organization. I know that this post will probably not be a popular one with some but I have to comment that the Reflector is truly what holds S and D together. While the annual and chapter meetings are always great fun, the magazine is the one common connector. I know a lot of you are just happy to get the magazine when it arrives and I certainly am too. But, I've lost track now of what issues I've already paid for and haven't received. I don't have the solution except to suggest that maybe we pay for each issue as it comes out. Again I've always enjoyed being a part of S and D but I am concerned about the consistency and what message it sends to possible future members. Should we consider moving to two issues a year? Your comments pro or con are welcome. I'm very glad the organization is around for all us boat and river nuts and I'd l like to see it continue for as long as there are people interested to be a part of it.

Aaron

I've been hearing the same from others. Among them is 50 plus year member Fred McCabe. He has had the same thoughts as you all these past few years. Each year that he renews may be his last. Anymore, he seems dissatisfied with the direction the organization is heading and like many of you, wonder where the organization is going to end up eventually. Something needs to change, and the only thing I can say, as a young member, is that we need many more younger members...

Both - renewal and Reflector - arrived at our landing today.

Carmen

Domestic won once?

What? You mean we got our issues before you did, for a change? Must have been the volcanic ash slowing down your delivery! Doc had submitted an article about a year ago about the Streckfus family dealings with docking issues so I had been expecting to see that. Maybe next time.