Windy days on the river

The MQ and wind

The short answer is: YES. We have an area here above L&D 13, which is the widest part of the Mississippi, over 3.5 miles wide. Whenever the MQ came through in windy weather, we'd joke about them staying out of the stumpfields, which were just outside the channel up there around Mile 527 UMR. They unfortunately were too well acquainted with them. The west wind hitting that tall flat superstructure was quite a challenge.
In New Orleans, before we got the new dock for the NATCHEZ, when there was a strong onshore wind, a tugboat would often dock at the Bienville Wharf, just in case we needed assistance getting out. That only cost us a bottle of Jack Daniels, but if we had to radio to the headquarters, it would have been the hourly fee. Of course, the harder it is to get away from the dock, the faster it is to return. Again in the old days, relative to the NATCHEZ anyway, we had one pilot who we knew would kiss the dock right at our Specialty Bar if there was a strong onshore wind, so we'd remove all the liquor bottles from the racks prior to the landing approach. The new wharf has fantastic padding like the gambling boats used the little bit they cruised - couldn't have the roulette wheel rock and roll!

i knew i always had issues putting dad's Chris Craft in the slip in the wind, but it's just a small fiberglass boat. Somehow i thought with the larger heavier boats that they wouldn't be as susceptible to the wind.
Thankyou for your prompt answer.

Chris Purdom;23042 wrote: i knew i always had issues putting dad's Chris Craft in the slip in the wind, but it's just a small fiberglass boat. Somehow i thought with the larger heavier boats that they wouldn't be as susceptible to the wind.
Thankyou for your prompt answer.

In the right wind, the MQ and AQ superstructures turned them into sailboats. One day on the AQ, we suddenly lost all electrical power and, well, all power. Going topside I appreciated the irony in that we were right in front of an electric plant. Cap had quite a time with her until a couple of tugs showed up to steady her while the generators came back on line. I'm not even sure how he did it.

Paul

Yes, I have seen some interesting times on these bigger boats in wind-and, as a passenger have said a lot of prayers for those pilots fighting the windy battles up there! Judy mentioned Lock 13; I recall the JULIA BELLE SWAIN encountering a few wind related problems there, as this was part of her regular run when she went Le Claire-Chestnut Mountain traveling through Locks 13 and 12.
Didn't they keep some helper boats handy up in that area just in case of wind problems
as well as assisting tows with the double lockings? I think many of them were named "Sir ---" and belonged to Canton Marine. We got help from one of them on the D.Q. once when we encountered wind above Lock 19.

Wind & Ships !!

Greetings From New Orleans !
Chris , to answer your question concerning the effect of wind on river vessels , regardless if they're steamboats , towboats , barges and yes even SHIPS , yes the wind does have a major effect on the posture of the vessel in the river !
I distinctly remember on one of the Str. Mississippi Queen's , Sea Trials , out of Jeff Boat , we actually had to cut short the Sea Trial and come in early due to the high winds .
I also recall , piloting some vessels , when we would actually have to
" CRAB " , to move at more or less a diagonal angle , either up or down the river , in order to continue the trip .
Generally speaking , the deeper of the draft of the vessel equates to the lesser amount of effect has on the same vessel . Two reasons ; No. 1 , there is less " Sail " ( the amount of space or area above the waterline ) , No.2 , there is more weight for the wind to blow against . Therefore , any vessel like a steamboat or a ship will be more likely to feel the effect of a wind !
Never underestimate the force of the wind ! Think of what Hurricane Katrina had on the city of New Orleans and imagine the force that wind has on water !
Furthermore , it has been my experience from piloting the ships , that wind is also a major factor as well .
Think of it for a moment . You have this rather blunt and some what un streamline object , literally in a fluid ( water ) environment and when you have a force working on it such as the wind , especially at a 90 degree angle , the wind will definately have some degree of effect !
Furthermore , this effect of the wind will only increase as this same vessel's speed through the water decreases ! The only way to counter this adverse effect of the wind is to either maintain or even increase this same vessel's speed through the water .
Having said that , another issue may raise its ugly head , especially if your in the process of docking this vessel to a stationary structure , such as a dock !
The problem is , you need the head way to move through the water to counter the " set " of the wind but you are also simply running out of time and space , so as not to over run your stationary dock ! What I do on the ships , in this situation is to simply have the stern tug boat to back his engines in order to slow my head way through the water and then to use the ship's engine , propeller and rudder to simply steer the vessel through the water and onto the dock . I would also have the forward tug boat , back his engines in order to pull out or to at least check the set of the bow of the ship onto the dock .
Trust me there is so much more to dealing with wind and especially when going alongside a stationary object such as a dock .
Smooth Sailing !
Ted Davisson

Chris Purdom;23040 wrote: Does the wind cause problems for the larger boats, ie..Delta Queen size and up, and towboats with barges?
I was watching a little towboat spudding down just upriver from the GV II and listening in on the vhf and they decided to put both spuds down so the wind wouldn't blow them around. Got me to wondering whether the wind would push around the bigger boats as easy. I know when I was trucking the wind would push us around on the highway.

I've been on the Belle of Louisville when wind was blowing heavy chairs over the rails. If we could "see" a strong wind coming we would choke a willow. If we got caught out we would back into it (sternwheelers, like cows, prefer to keep the wind behind them) and she would usually hold her own against the wind.

When turning, if the wind was stiff, we would flip, or somersault, the boat to drive her head into the wind. The technnique is roughly - back the stern with the rudders set slightly the way you do NOT want to go and back slow. Watch the stern. When it starts moving sidewise, change the rudders hard down in the direction you DO want the stern to go and back full. The boat will swing its head into the wind. When you have about 30 to 45 degrees to go, switch rudders again and come ahead. Momentum will straighten her into the wind.

Don't try this until you learn to handle!

That almost sounds like it requires skill. According to several newspaper writers, Assocation Pilots are just "Over Paid Bus Drivers". Guess now were going to get some lecture about how each dock is different due to river conditions, weather, ship size and draft, etc. Please accept the media's POV and stop trying to confuse the issue with hard facts and the realities of river life. 🙂

Fred , Right Again But !!!!

Fred ,
Once again , you are right on the money with your dry wit and ecletic analysis of the river and ship or boat handling situations in general !
I am though very disappointed with the fact that you over looked the fact that many in the local New Orleans marine industry think of not only the three recognized state pilot associations and pilots in general as , " Over Paid And Glorified Bus Drivers " , with no disrespect to Bus Drivers !!
I have often thought of the diverse role of a Pilot and even a Pilot on any type of vessel and on any type of run and situation !
Why for the most part are Pilots ( not Pirates ) looked down on and are the butt of many jokes and sarcasism ??
Smooth Sailing !
Ted Davisson

Fred Carmichael;23062 wrote: That almost sounds like it requires skill. According to several newspaper writers, Assocation Pilots are just "Over Paid Bus Drivers". Guess now were going to get some lecture about how each dock is different due to river conditions, weather, ship size and draft, etc. Please accept the media's POV and stop trying to confuse the issue with hard facts and the realities of river life. 🙂

Thanks Ted, that pretty much nailed was i was thinking. I had thought that the deeper draft would have less problems with the wind. I know what the wind does to the water, seen enough whitecaps and much bigger wind driven waves before. wasn't meaning wind as strong as hurricanes either. Really not sure what you would do if it was hurricane force, except maybe pray without ceasing.

Wind was more of a factor than anything as to whether or not we left the dock with the Graceful Ghost. I finally got one of those hand held wind speed indicators, which are nifty little gadgets, removing all doubt. We usually drew the line at 20 mph predictions. If we had a full boat, we felt better about it. Gusts are another thing. One day I clocked a 30 mph gust, and I was just glad it was a gust. We came to a complete standstill. Those trips were one and one half hour of praying without ceasing.

Gusts

I'm quite aware gusts are another thing. Had a few of those when i was sailing the concrete seas with a 53 foot billboard behind me. After some of them i've been known to look for a wide spot on the side and stop to wait for the heart to slow down.
That's interesting that 20 mph was the line you drew. Even without the wind blowing you around, it could make the water a bit choppy to.

Twenty mph or knots is also a line drawn by some great sailing competitions, which doesn't make sense unless you realize that those big racers are sensitive to the slightest breeze, and might become dangerous in a nice wind. I had a canoe with a sailing rig, once, and I didn't even bother taking it out unless there were white caps. Otherwise, it wouldn't move.